Future Games of DG

Firstly these are just a couple of ideas I have briefly discussed with Frosty which should be possible in the current engine but there is no comment on them.

Currently it is the case that DG has too few people and those that are here are too static and so there is no real room for growth. Even with the changes to navigation it is likely we will see the same outcomes as in the last Beta and also the last few rounds of DG.

DG needs a sufficiently large number of new players to break that position and to grow into the game it once was and I would think, without exception, everyone wants and agrees with that. So the question is how to go about it.

The purpose of this thread is to float some suggestions aimed at growing DG again considering it is no longer 2001 - yes DG is over 20 years old now.

DG currently has 2 game modes.

The Full Round over 3 months which is really the same as a full season of any team sport. The game fluctuates but usually the most organised for the longest makes it to the top end of the game. People do set their own goals but it is hard to carry on if you get attacked and reduced back to a couple of planets unless you have a good alliance backing you.

Fairly accessible depending on what you aim to do but can be off putting along with the time involved and so I am not sure just having this is the way to grow DG.

This currently leaves the Speed Game. This is really for the hardcore that can stay awake for 2 days and so while less time consuming than a Full Round I see this as being a challenge mode and not really accessible .

Even with a new mobile friendly UI it is likely to be difficult without the time in front of a PC. I don’t see this as the best quick route for getting in to DG.

Having given it a little thought I have come up with 2 additional modes to supplement the game and maybe help bridge the gap for new players used to different types of games.

First is DG RPG (Combat Evolved) - working title.

Large portions of DG are spent waiting for Planet Limit to go do something and farming in the meantime while maybe having some skirmishes so I suggest the following:

Start with Home Planet but can only colonise 1 other planet.

That planet will have a much larger ground and orbit space while keeping the abundances very close together so that there would be no “bad” planet to colonise. Any deficiencies in abundance can be made up with research.

Higher outputs from buildings.

Population grows as per the last Beta, so buildings give X number of workers per turn.

Only Combat Score is tracked.

Invasions give Combat Score but cannot take the planet.

Game length 1 month or 1000 turns.

No alliances.

The idea is to focus on one thing which is combat, you can’t win farming. With population growth as in the last Beta if you get invaded back to 0 workers then the next turn you will still have workers to build up from and so are not knocked out of the game completely.

Short game length means more can be run and so even if you do end up quitting for some reason you haven’t lost much time or have long to wait to restart.

While you can informally team up with people the idea of not having alliances is to try and make the game a bit more open on who can be attacked. There is no need to worry about NAPs or their friend’s 70 player alliance stomping you because you shot down a freighter.

Second is an actual competitive version of DG - League of DG - working title.

The problem with both game modes of DG is the question of who is the best? Usually it is more about who farmed the longest or managed to get an easier start where they don’t have to waste resources early on in fighting too hard.

So again starting with a Home Planet but starting with 5 Outposts.

Quick turn times lasting a total of 8 hours.

No more Outposts can be built.

Planet Limit researched in the normal way. Maybe with changes to costs.

As an example 5 player maximum but is scalable.

No alliances.

Aim is first to 10 planets wins.

Multiple games run at the same time. So in this example 5 games with 5 players each.

Winner from each game goes into a final.

Remaining players would be 20 so these would be shuffled into 4 new groups of 5 for playoffs.

Winners of the playoffs go into final with 1 extra wild entry from the groups.

Final is aimed at running to a higher planet number needed but still within the 8 hour limit so whoever gets closest if no outright winner at that time wins.

The one easily trackable outcome is number of planets owned.

This setup focuses on invading planets but can be completed over the course of 2 weeks if needed but I would have it over a month.

1 weekend the first rounds, next weekend the playoffs and the next the final. This leaves a free weekend each month for the normal Speed Game or just a break.

This is based on solo play but I think you can also have team based of 3-5 players in each team. The number of planets needed can be tweaked easily enough but there is still the clear winning goal.

Numbers across both would be scalable dependent on interest, if 1000 people want to play you don’t want to be running 200 games.

Limiting alliance involvement again gives people more of an equal footing but allowing small teams could kick start some new alliances.

Open to anyone’s thoughts although I would prefer none of the ‘change is bad’ type comments.

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Really do not have any comment on game modes. My comment is building the game back to a bigger and better position. The first thing that has to happen is to get the game going. We cannot promote a game that is “gonna be”. I first found out about DG by word of mouth and not from surfing the internet. The game fit my lifestyle and still does. I confess that I am more of a farmer than I should be but again it fits me better with time allotted to play. My schedule will not let me sit for hours in front of the computer screen. The fact that it allows me to schedule builds and travel and then walk away for a little bit fits me. The alliance gives me the protections that I need to be able to do this. I can participate with the alliance on attacks and such and still maintain my independence. But from a participation standpoint, I know several people whose schedule is similar to mine. During the time that I was playing I brought in several players who played for the remaining duration of the game. Oe thing I can suggest is a game sponsored group called a newby alliance that allows new players to learn the game before participating against bigger and better competition. Put restrictions on them (planet limits etc.) and the other bigger alliances about attacks on the newbies. You can even have members of the bigger alliances to serve in two alliances at the same time one as an advisor to the newbies (one member per newby alliance). When I first joined DG I came close to quitting the game before I got a good start because of attacks by larger alliances. The first such attack wiped me out except for my home planet. At the time I had built up my game and was larger than I probably should have been but I did not belong to another alliance and therefore was left open to attack. I had been fighting against other alliances of my size and numbers. In any case I am all for promoting the game and doing what I can to help grow DG. But let’s get it going first. Put the changes out there and see what happens. Put limits on games that may grow exponentially quickly.

tl:dr

When do we get to play?

2 Likes

Fun test balloons, however (and no I’m not talking down on you Frosty you’re just 1 person) for dg to succeed it would need to to be run like a serious game and not a hobby project. More people, more professional.

These test balloons might be fun to fool around with, with the current community tho. I thoroughly agree that with the current community you’d get a repetition each beta of the same fights.

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Key here in my opinion is the need for new players to join DG. First and foremost that requires a running game.

second to that is the new player experience, will they like it and continue to play and attract more players to the game? For this the current community has some room for improvement all the same.

I think rounds should be shorter to start with, new players dont like waiting 2 months to get started on “even” grounds. Multiple rounds running could help this, but require an even larger player base. Even though we might like the 3 month rounds, its not particularly friendly for new players.

Suggestion could be to have 1 round of 3 months running for the settled community, while running shorter startup rounds, starting bi-weekly or so and lasting 1 month, where you get some quicker development/expansion and arrange some more experienced players to invest in new players/alliances these rounds.

That way the next 3month round could get a proper influx of new players that have arranged themselves already.

well, its been 2 days thinking about an answer that might be usefull…

20 years ago, internet was not available everywhererm, everytime.
I know many (most?) of you live in countries where developement was already there, but evertheless, mobile access wasnt a thing.
In that world, i used to schedule my day (and my life at some times) arround the DG turns. Sometimes even adapted lists because i knew i was ont able to get internet access at 6 am…

y2k DG was great, and after that, found some friends playing OGame, which looked like a horrible copy, but instead of hours, was in real time (OGAME launched in october 2002)
The sucess was hugem and in 2004 TRAVIAN took the same model and still is one o the most played games.-

BOTH spent some bucks in publicity, and i remember banners everywhere.
I even played travian (won some servers in latin america) for a couple of years, and met some ppl who spent a lot of money in the game.

but also knew other games which never launched for more than 500/600 players (GueRed, and Planet Zombies).

Those games were better, but maybe niche. One of the aspects the last one was signed as “fun but not serious” was the concept art, like a comic book for kids

Anyways, as William Wallace precisely points out, there is no chance of growing about “a future” game, unless u can get Keanu Reeves to make a promotion!!!

The spice must flow.

So, i throw some ideas:

  1. The world moves faster. For the old guard, 1 hour turns allow to “live” and work while playing. Hardcore players also spend more time. So instead of 1 hour turns, make them 1/2 hour. Double all the turns. So the only effective chance will be that instead of 1 visit per hour, you get 2, just to check comms, and keep the interest up

  2. Instead of a fix nomber of planets, and the comms resource scan war, a differnt approach: The resources are full visible, and the research allows to gather points of resource so, if you want to conquiera a 100/100/100/100, you will need more time to get the research points neded. So there is another tactical desicion to be taken care. The players who opt for more planets will be able to colonize them faster, and newcomers love having tons of planets and farming.
    Having bigger planets would mean less total planets, and the amount of points needed to invade them is also a way to defend.

  3. Longer time travels to outer galaxies, as a way to be more newbie friendly

  4. As a community, i suggest, for a couple of rounds, NOT TO PLAY WITH FRIENDS and former alliances. It might help getting over some old concepts, but also, to avoid powerblocks and helping the newer players to get inserted in an alliance which might not be top tier since 1995 :stuck_out_tongue: jajaja

  5. I agree that 3 months is a pretty long run. 1 month rounds, with 1 week to rest, seems a good way to keep ppl interested, at least while we get a bigger base

I’m gonna address this point directly, because it’s frankly absurd, and to an extent, offensive… For better or worse, DG is back in its ‘infancy’ stage, not a massive number of players, those rediscovering not hanging around for a while, and the hardcore players bickering among themselves scaring off people who are willing to give it a try…

If EVERYONE who participated in the last test donated £5 a month to DG, it wouldn’t even cover my mortgage, let alone the costs of hiring other developers (it would barely cover the server costs, which I’m paying out of pocket). Where there’s no money, there’s no incentive, people who would volunteer would do so on a ‘hobby’ basis, which means I cannot (legally, or otherwise) dictate how much time or effort they would be required to put into working on DG.

There’s a certain ludicrousness to the idea that DG could, in any way, be considered a ‘company’ with managers and staff, especially at this point… There’s legitimately no way to finance it as such, I still have to maintain a full time job in order to simply pay the bills, which relegates DG to a hobby project.

As I’ve mentioned on Discord, I’m going to be looking into ways the community can contribute to code, and help move DG forward (this will likely be related to the ‘new’ engine for it), or even hold mini coding competitions with bounties for things like combat to see how other people would do it, and reward them for their efforts, but this will always be a ‘hobby’ thing for anyone involved.

By your logic, I should throw in the towel and cancel the entire game and call it now… But I’m not gonna do that, because in the future DG absolutely could be something, but it’s important to appreciate scope, ambition, and the real world first.

Your interpretation of that sentence is not at all what I meant by it. There is a lot of room between “a company with managers” and doing everything by yourself.

So a small response to your interpretation:

Volunteers could support you, volunteers are unpaid people which doesn’t mean there are no expectations or obligations. You can most definately dictate the terms under which you accept volunteers.

Money wise there have been offers for support which you declined (which is completely your choice) because you didn’t want to feel obligated which is again completely your choice.

I think in order to succeed there needs to be some sort of expectation and obligation. Which is all I meant with moving away from a hobby project. You can disagree with that or simply don’t want that, that’s fine. You’re in charge, I was merely sharing my thoughts.

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I started playing DG back in the day and loved the game. I did take it seriously but I was not willing to devote the time (did not have the time) that it takes to be really good at it. Fortunately, I was able to join an alliance that was patient with me and taught me a lot about the game. I am a newbie sympathizer and think that professionalism is only a small fraction of the game. This game has been run from the standpoint of creating an atmosphere that all players can relate to regardless of experience. I for one want it to stay that way. I do not like the dog-eat-dog mentality that usually develops with that attitude. While the potential for such a game is still there it was and I hope still is a game that is friendly to both serious players and yes including the hobbyists. That is my preference. Frosty I do have one suggestion about reporting things. I have tried to keep up with DG on discord but every time I get on here all I am able to connect to is several months old at best. Please put a month and year on all announcements for idiots like myself who do not get on Discord except when you send me notifications. Also, may I suggest that all material dated 6 months or older be deleted from Discord. I am not computer illiterate but I am old. LOL.

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Way to make me feel old! That’s the only comment I can make at the moment as I’ve missed everything that’s been attempted in many, many, many, manymanymany moons. But finding some way to attract new players is obviously a good thing. I just have a lot of catching up to do to figure out what might be wrong :stuck_out_tongue: